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 Post subject: Eli's orange drift TG - now 4ZE1+T, massive update P16
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 10:14 pm 
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Location: Adelaide, SA. Cars: 5 Geminis and a Piazza
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Hey everyone,

Well, I had been building a blue TG as my track car, but it was cursed, everything went wrong, and after it broke down on the way back from Melbourne I reached the point where I didn't even want to look at it, and simply couldn't get excited and motivated with plans for it anymore... So I put up a WTB to see what was out there for a track project. I almost bought a silver and black TD sedan off of Tunney, but it was missing everything, needed a ton of work, wasn't even rolling, had no bumpers, a crap 161, no exhaust, inlet etc and he wanted $400. Not really what I was after - I'd been through an ordeal getting the last one going, and I have four other cars to work on, so I just wanted something fairly simple.

Then I saw this.

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G180Z, 32/36, extractors, 5spd, heavy duty clutch, Lovell springs, dished Saas steering wheel, retrimmed interior, Eclipse 6x9s, 15" mesh style wheels and a half decent coat of paint. It's orange with a blue pearl, the paint job itself is pretty dodgy, runs, orange peel etc, but for a track car it's awesome! Really distinctive. I'm not a fan of orange but at least it doesn't look like a s@*tter, quite noticeable. It was last rego'd in ACT, as far as I know, but when taken through the pits here (or on the street, who knows) got defected, in SA. No problem, it'll keep me focused! Car has slight blow-by but otherwise runs awesomely, purrs like a kitten and no flat spots! Only thing was, it came without the bumpers, with TG taillights and missing the front apron.

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I had two weeks until the first ever drift day at Tailem Bend. I was originally going to have my own private track day on that day, but the drift event was set to be a huge day, so I postponed my event to allow it to go ahead, and as a bonus, had automatic shotgun on a place. Glad I did.

My to-do list was along the lines of:
-Get a locked diff
-Change oil and filter
-Change coolant and thermo
-Flush and bleed brakes, pedal felt s*#t
-Fit my Bendix pads
-Fit my Familia seats
-Fit bumpers
-Fit TE taillights
-Fit fire extinguisher
-Paint and fit my front lip
-Fix bizarre click in steering column

Bought a "locked" 8-bolt diff off of Kart for $80, he told me (as I assume he was told by the previous owner) that it was locked by a diff shop.. The catch was the handbrake cable had been cut, as had one trailing arm (wtf lol) to remove it from his coupe.. But he also gave me a pair of backing plates with a good cable... However things didn't turn out to be so simple. Opened the diff up, the "welded centre" was complete rubbish, a few pissy spot welds. The axles even had play to open-wheel for 30 degrees!

So I finished setting up my new welder, a gas/gasless 150A mig, running gasless. It did great, actually melted some of the spider gear carrier on full heat! Had to back it off slightly. Well, I welded it up pretty solidly, could have done better but didn't have the time. Cleaned up welding splatter and other mess, axles back in, and with the gf's help, swapped the brake assemblies onto the new backing plates and onto the diff.

Then had to get the diff in, change the brake lines on the diff, bleed the system and clean out the fluid reservoir which was filthy. The click in the clutch pedal was simply because it was run wrong - coiled around the steering column. Painted up the front bar etc, looked great but didn't have time to fit it in the end. I was up past midnight all week leading upto the event getting things done, and at 11:30PM the night before the event, about to drive the thing onto the trailer - it wouldn't start! Had a bit of a rage, felt like the world was just against me getting to the track and that I'd always just be some wannabe on the sidelines - I've wanted to enter an event since I was like, five... haha

Anyway, turns out the starter wire, which was joined in the engine bay by being crammed into a plastic holder, had come out! But in frantically searching under the dash for the problem, I knocked out a dodgy masking tape join on the ignition barrel wires. Took a while to figure that one out too, and in doing so I found about four other live uninsulated and pointless wires... Great work. But anyway, fixed it all up by 2AM, loaded up the car and trailer and got to bed at about 2:30AM

Got less than five hours sleep, and drove a slightly fishtailing trailer upto Tailem Bend behind a Jeep that was getting a bit warm.. But made it, and was extremely excited. Track started out wet, but dried up fast. I ticked myself as a "beginner" on the forms, we got grouped with intermediates and did a tighter course, but I'm glad I was on that course, the expert course was way too fast and wide for my poor little G180Z.

I was running some ancient tyres on some 5 spoke 15"s I got from shorty in Vic as skidders, pumped up to 37psi. They were great, but grip dropped off real fast and they delaminated after a few runs - made the car a bit unpredictable from one run to the next. I shredded two pairs, and whacked on some 155/80R13"s on 6" wide rims, I wasn't really expecting to get through the other two pairs, but the 155's went well. By comparison they actually felt grippy lol, but I adjusted to suit and my second run on them went fantastic.

Unfortunately by this point, around 2:30pm, I was getting real tired, my girlfriend (who was taking video from the sidelines) was frozen, one of my mates seemed pretty buggered, and the other (who provided the tow car) had a ton of TAFE work to do... A few of the pro's had left too, and I wasn't sure if my group would get another run, so we called it a day. It was a fantastic day, and by the end I could link most of the track. On my last few runs I got the sweepers too, the very last run I actually linked the sweepers. I can't wait to go back there in two weeks' time for my private day, I think with a bit more speed and confidence I'll link the whole track! :D

Here are some pics and videos, check back soon cause my internet's being a bitch, there will be more!

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Image>>> Like my drift page on Facebook for pics

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My Gemini drift videos: http://www.youtube.com/PandamoniumDrift
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Current tally: 5 Geminis and a Piazza


Last edited by archangel62 on Mon Feb 09, 2015 12:16 pm, edited 30 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 10:32 pm 
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Location: Adelaide, SA. Cars: 5 Geminis and a Piazza
Here's someone else's vid of me sliding the track, I think the tyres were delaminating in the run, had no grip by the end lol:
http://www.youtube.com/user/Irpwr#p/a/u/2/c0u8uBi6ssM
Shame they missed my entry though, corner 1 was easily my best.

Uploading vids gradually... Camera was my phone taped to my mirror lol:

1:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AU8g9wOereg
2:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFUQQnEQN8U
3:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPBZCyPXAAY
4:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVku-5uR2DQ
5:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBfClweI0wo
6th:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HO_w78FOft4
7th:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F22JV8451fk

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My Gemini drift videos: http://www.youtube.com/PandamoniumDrift
Follow us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/PandamoniumDrift
Current tally: 5 Geminis and a Piazza


Last edited by archangel62 on Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:44 am, edited 4 times in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 07, 2010 10:54 pm 
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Location: Baulkham Hills (NSW)
good too see another gem havn fun at the track, id love too start doin this myself but not an option just yet ohwell tho, id rather be hillclimbin tho


more pics

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Yes, i do still own my coupe, Yes it is still registered and running and ATM driven daily.


oh and NO its not painted yet


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 1:11 am 
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Location: Adelaide, SA. Cars: 5 Geminis and a Piazza
Yeah I definitely want to get this thing to hillclimbs and grip too, but drift is so goddamn fun, it's definitely the priority!

The plan from here is to throw my mild cam in, electronic ign it, sort out the ffffcked brake bias (it must just be 8 bolt diffs! feels like the pedal's just another handbrake) and fit my adjustable whiteline rear sway and K-mac front.

Apart from that I'm happy for now, I'd like to look into some form of cheapish power like a DIY turbo+EFI setup, I just want to have fun work my way towards competition standard (even though I'd lose haha) but I don't want to lose focus with my other projects which for the time being will take financial priority!

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My Gemini drift videos: http://www.youtube.com/PandamoniumDrift
Follow us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/PandamoniumDrift
Current tally: 5 Geminis and a Piazza


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 8:12 pm 
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Location: sunshine coast
if your rears are locking early that'll be an advantage when drifting :lol:

not so much at hillclimbs tho

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1975 TX coupe 4ZD1 efi turbo 10.787 @ 123/128
1977 TC Fashion Pack sedan draw through turbo
1984 TG PF60E dohc Group A racecar
1984 TG Panelvan
2006 Crewman SS 6.0


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 8:41 pm 
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Location: Newcastle, Aus
Im gonna have a go at the early locking issue.

The early 8 bolt diffs use wheel cylinder P7041 which has a diametre 19.05mm.

The late diffs use a P10046 which is 22.22mm.

The smaller cylinder with lesser volume will fill faster, and therefore actuate faster. Its more compilcated then that in reality, but you get the idea.

So maybe use a late wheel cylinder, or change the proportioning valve to an early one.

Cheers Nick

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 9:36 pm 
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Haha f*#k yeah that black S13 was off tap.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:58 pm 
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redzone (coxy) wrote:
if your rears are locking early that'll be an advantage when drifting :lol:

not so much at hillclimbs tho


lol! Well, I generally group it under "f***ing scary" - few times heading at corner 1 I was going a bit hot, hit the skids to scrape off some speed before initiating, since the entry road is narrow and bends gradually against the corner.. Then the brakes locked on me and I found myself in a big scando :lol: not all bad but it sucks not knowing when it's coming. Also at the end of the run you have to start braking out of the right sweeper and into the left, once I got third out of the right and had more speed than usual, hit the skids coming into the left and ended up linking it accidentally upto the cones, lucky I didn't get told off lol. Last run I did I used this and kept on the skids just to keep it out for a bit of fun!

Stubbsy you make an interesting point on the wheel cyl sizes, I might have an unopened pair of the later style, if I can be bothered I'll try that, but it's a big if, assembling the drum assemblies was a huge pain and I'm not keen to repeat it! But I dare say it'd either be the wheel cylinder size OR the master/PV combination - not both - will be interesting to find out which, and put an old rumour to rest. Perhaps very early TX's ran the P7041, and a PV to suit, then both PV and slaves changed, before the diff did, but it was another thing completely overlooked by aftermarket parts manufacturers.. Like once, when I ordered Whiteline springs and they asked me if it was for a TX. I said yes, and ended up with early early springs which dumped it 50mm too far. Seems my TX runs the same spring seats/etc as late Gems. That's a different car obviously but the point remains!

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My Gemini drift videos: http://www.youtube.com/PandamoniumDrift
Follow us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/PandamoniumDrift
Current tally: 5 Geminis and a Piazza


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 12:01 am 
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archangel62 wrote:
redzone (coxy) wrote:
if your rears are locking early that'll be an advantage when drifting :lol:

not so much at hillclimbs tho


lol! Well, I generally group it under "f***ing scary" - few times heading at corner 1 I was going a bit hot, hit the skids to scrape off some speed before initiating, since the entry road is narrow and bends gradually against the corner.. Then the brakes locked on me and I found myself in a big scando :lol: not all bad but it sucks not knowing when it's coming. Also at the end of the run you have to start braking out of the right sweeper and into the left, once I got third out of the right and had more speed than usual, hit the skids coming into the left and ended up linking it accidentally upto the cones, lucky I didn't get told off lol. Last run I did I used this and kept on the skids just to keep it out for a bit of fun!

Stubbsy you make an interesting point on the wheel cyl sizes, I might have an unopened pair of the later style, if I can be bothered I'll try that, but it's a big if, assembling the drum assemblies was a huge pain and I'm not keen to repeat it! But I dare say it'd either be the wheel cylinder size OR the master/PV combination - not both - will be interesting to find out which, and put an old rumour to rest. Perhaps very early TX's ran the P7041, and a PV to suit, then both PV and slaves changed, before the diff did, but it was another thing completely overlooked by aftermarket parts manufacturers.. Like once, when I ordered Whiteline springs and they asked me if it was for a TX. I said yes, and ended up with early early springs which dumped it 50mm too far. Seems my TX runs the same spring seats/etc as late Gems. That's a different car obviously but the point remains!


Hahah fair enough

When i said late diffs, i meant salisburys, which the TG would have had.

So borg warners (8 bolt) use the P7041, and salisbury use P10046

Cheers Nick

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 12:03 am 
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im no machenic, im really just a driver but if your gonna be drifting wouldnt you better off with N/A then a turbo? maybe some twin weber's or quads ;)

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 12:27 am 
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stubbsy212 wrote:
Hahah fair enough

When i said late diffs, i meant salisburys, which the TG would have had.

So borg warners (8 bolt) use the P7041, and salisbury use P10046

Cheers Nick


That's what I mean though, I mean, surely all BW Gems didn't roll out of the factory with f***ed balance. Maybe the proportioning valve and slave cylinders changed before the diff did, but noone knew?

Low-26L, most good drift cars use turbo - it doesn't matter how you get the power, as long as you have good throttle response and a wide powerband. Plus, NA power is just as "laggy" as turbo - a 4AGE won't make stuff all power til at least 4000rpm. That's more than enough revs for a turbo to spool. thing is, you need to have lots of power to drift properly on faster tracks - and there's a huge difference between a car that's drifting because the driver's a nutter who throws it in hard and never lifts, and a car with the same driver and twice the power. Sure, power's a band-aid for people who can't drift for s*#t, but it also allows a good driver more freedom to take a ballsy line, and attempt big manoeuvres they wouldn't otherwise be able to do. Now, I'm a complete noob, but I know that the times I linked the two sweepers, I had to be going hell hard, and follow the car's line. I couldn't have adjusted that line one bit - the car's power limit dictated where I had to point it. If I had big power I could have used the whole track and worked on an adventurous line going from apex to shoulder to apex, and come out of each bend with the speed to natural drift into the next, rather than pedal to the metal.

Sadly this is why the Yanks do well with their alloy V8s in tank cars - a refined, lightweight, high capacity NA engine that can rev is actually one of the best options for drifting - but it's also, mechanically, a complete cop-out with no class. I could drop any old V8 in a Gem and it'd go fast... But turbocharging a small-ish engine for revs, power AND response... Now THAT takes skill!

Not quite sure what I want to do yet. Thinking turbo G180Z, CA18DET, or something silly like cramming an RB20DET in there. At any rate it's gotta rev, make easy power, and not completely break the bank! Ideas?

And, noiseboy, yeah some of the S13s etc looked awesome, where'd you see em?

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Follow us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/PandamoniumDrift
Current tally: 5 Geminis and a Piazza


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 09, 2010 12:44 pm 
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ok then, guess i know even less then i thought i did, my last car was a g200 turbo and it didnt make power till about 4000rpm and evey gem i owned before that just had a single weber and they always spun the wheels as soon as let the clutch out, supose it just depends on the setup, go with the the silly sr20 :D

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 10, 2010 9:58 pm 
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archangel62 wrote:

And, noiseboy, yeah some of the S13s etc looked awesome, where'd you see em?


In the video's mate ;)

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 12:31 am 
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Location: Adelaide, SA. Cars: 5 Geminis and a Piazza
Ahh, didn't realise there was much of other cars - but yeah there were some sweet cars out!

Just fitted the front lip. Two cable ties at either end, and I might add a central one or two when I take the bumper off to fit the tow points.

Image

'scuse s%*tty pic quality.

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My Gemini drift videos: http://www.youtube.com/PandamoniumDrift
Follow us on Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/PandamoniumDrift
Current tally: 5 Geminis and a Piazza


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 7:09 pm 
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as far as power goes, drop in a 4G63 galant VR4 motor with a 2litre scorpion/sigma alloy case 5 speed, and the flywheel from the same car, custom clutch (2L sigma type) and the usual RWD conversion pieces which i can show you on austarion if you like..

these motors will cop well over 250rwkw for years without pulling the head off as long as the tune's decent. one guy in qld has over 500 rwhp in an evo 8 with stock bottom end...

pretty easy mount wise to do the 4G63 in a gem too, mounts are a similar angle in a similar position..

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GARAGE REDZONE sunshine coast ph 07 54433507

1975 TX coupe 4ZD1 efi turbo 10.787 @ 123/128
1977 TC Fashion Pack sedan draw through turbo
1984 TG PF60E dohc Group A racecar
1984 TG Panelvan
2006 Crewman SS 6.0


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